Right. Sure. Ok. Just like the "Patriot Act" would only be used to fight terrorism. Like American citizens in Fairbanks, Alaska.
Even if that were true, even if no American citizen would ever be violated by the provisions of NDAA 2012, they'll soon take care of that small inconvenience (citizenship) with HR 3166, the "Enemy Expatriation Act".
Deemed a "terrorist", or "providing aid" to one, under this law, US citizens would be stripped of their American citizenship. Stripped of citizenship, all bets and pretenses of protection are off.
This bill, combined with the NDAA, irrevocably binds the course of this nation to one path.
Is there any doubt in your mind?
Yes, the bill is in committee. It may not make it out.
Even so, I suggest we make an effort to let these people in DC know, in unequivocal and extremely harsh terms, what this bill means to us.
An extra special bit of love goes out to:
Bill Sponsor:
Rep. Charles Dent [R-PA15]
Co-Sponsors:
Patriot:
ReplyDeleteThank you for the alert.
This information is now posted on my own web site, "OUR ETERNAL STRUGGLE", and I also sent notice to Congressman Palazzo.
John Robert Mallernee
Armed Forces Retirement Home
Gulfport, Mississippi 39507
In my opinion, this bill is only icing on the cake. For decades the government has been able to kill anyone it wants with impunity, citizen or not. This will scare those who haven't been paying attention, but to me, it's not that much of a surprise.
ReplyDeleteThink of the posters we could make...
There can be no doubt where this leads.
ReplyDeleteA saavy investor might research box car companies about now.
Forgive me for using your comment section to write an essay of my own, but it's my way of chilling after a post like this.
ReplyDeleteEveryone wonders when it's "over the top." It's been over the top for an awfully long time. The sinkholes of wealth destruction are themselves over the top. Waco and Ruby Ridge were over the top. Jose Guerena was over the top. The NDAA is so far over the top that it defies description. We could list literally thousands of laws, trials, arrests and murders that were over the top and everyone knows this, whether they consciously admit it or not.
I can only speak for myself, and you said it best..."I own me." I see nothing but individuals out there and it'll be over the top for me personally when some SOB tries to "prove" that this isn't true, that I don't own myself. I don't accept the denial of reality and I'll be damned if I ever concede that utter falsity.
I also don't accept that any answer can possibly lie in destruction. I mean, there's plenty that has to be stopped obviously, but answers in the human realm always consist of building...of creating and producing. Me, I've already started a new business, I expect to start more, and hopefully I'll join with others to create and produce so much value that the irresistible force of this good, will overwhelm the supposedly immovable object of thuggery and evil that's all around us.
Alright, that was all for me, a catharsis if you will. Here's what I've got for the readers. Philosophy is my thing and I've been writing for years that the fundamental principle guiding nearly all Americans is this---"Maybe logic doesn't hold."
So this is my message for anyone who cares. This is what producers and soldiers and all decent Americans MUST come to grasp, else it'll be death of them just as sure as the Sun rises. The message is this---"Logic holds."
LOGIC ALWAYS HOLDS, because logic is just the reflection of reality. So every person better come to recognize this, because every person's life depends on it, like literally.
Logic holds, and the function of a rational being who seeks both life and happiness, is to recognize this and act accordingly. What we see around us is real, and all the wishing in the world won't make it go away. Logical action, will.
I wish everyone a Happy New Year even in the face of the madness, and damn there's a mighty mountain to climb. I for one intend to get there. Win.
There it is then.There can be no more doubt.If citizenship can be stripped on the whim of a man or group of men,there seems to be no hope of recourse.
ReplyDeleteLives,fortunes and sacred honor.
All in or stay on the porch.
My but they are some busy little beavers up there in the District of Criminals. Perhaps they're a little nervous about something? It sure looks like it. Good, they should be nervous...
ReplyDeleteI knew Dent through a mutual acquaintance, when he first ventured into politics in the late 1980s.
ReplyDeleteHe was slimy then and he is slimier now.
Among politicians however he is merely normal.
Listen up folks: I do what I can with the politicians I know. I call in favors, presume on friendships, and in general make them listen to very uncomfortable words about their place in the scheme of things. If they fuck up I hold them personally responsible.
Does it change anything?
It might. If they have a residual conscience it might even be the motive for repentance.
But I am only one of 300,000,000. Imagine if we all did what I do.
Outsourcing our governance -- and then forgetting about it so we can do whatever it is we do -- is asking to be treated like a slave.
Do you want to live in a better country? THEN THINK LIKE AN OWNER NOT A TENANT.
These peckerheads work for us. Act like it.
Now off to yammer at Dent until his drones hang up on me. Again.
We expatriated Tories, or they chose to leave after their homes and businesses were burned, and after many individual Torie Judges and Magistrates were tarred and feathered.
ReplyDeleteIt sucks to be in a civil war. And it really sucks to lose.
Resist.
Win.
As a native born Southron, an unreconstructed one at that, there's no doubt in my mind at what the US government is planning, we've seen it here before.
ReplyDeleteMy great grandparents lived through the indiscriminate shelling of Charleston, South Carolina; fought to keep the Yankee terrorists out of our land, and while not successful in the end, we put them on notice about how we fight.
We will fight again.
I working up a collection of fliers and matierals. The blue one, titled "Defend..." is re: NDAA and HR 3166.
ReplyDeletehttp://catotheamerican.wordpress.com/2012/01/02/wtf-campaign-flier/
Don't puke, that only soils your boots. Punch them right square in the face, with brass nux, for assaulting you in a cowardly manner and for being an admitted stupid ass.
ReplyDeleteIt perhaps bears repeating that any US military personnel following illegal orders pursuant to the NDAA are in violation of their oaths.
ReplyDeleteSwearing to support and defend the Constitution, then bearing arms against those same principles is as heinous a form of treason as can be imagined.
Treason has always been dealt with extremely harshly, especially by those who have been betrayed.
This must be made very clear to those currently in uniform.
Treason is defined in the US Constitution, Article III, Section 3, a portion of which says, "Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying war against them, or in adhering to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort"
ReplyDeleteMaking war against them is what Lincoln did, making Lincoln the worst traitor in US history because his actions caused the deaths of nearly one million Americans, Obushma loves Lincoln and would like to do the same.
@Pilgrims Pride, I'm not interested in playing their game and *they* don't work for me.
ReplyDelete@Anonymous, clinging to that *goddamned piece of paper* is what got things to where they are. It is an abstract, meant to be violated, so you better zoom back and take a good hard look at the long view.
NOBODY gets to harm anybody else and it doesn't require an instruction booklet to figure it out.
@Jim Bravo: "A saavy investor might research box car companies about now."
ReplyDeleteNah, just look up the Jeckeln System and Vasili Blokhin. They'll go with that approach first.
But then again - Warren Buffett was investing heavily in rail transport...
When the time comes, I am taking people down with me. I'm not begging on my knee's period!
ReplyDeleteTakeNoPrisoners!-
ReplyDeleteGeneral Jackson, from Gods and Generals-
Colonel Stuart, if I had my way we would show no quarter to the enemy. No more than the redskin showed your troopers. The black flag, sir. If the North triumphs, it is not alone the destruction of our property, it is the prelude to anarchy, infidelity and the ultimate loss of free and responsible government on this continent. It is the triumph of commerce, banks and the factory. We should meet the Federal invaders on the outer verge of just and right defence, and raise at once the black flag. No quarter to the violaters of our homes and firesides. Our political leadership in Richmond is too timid to face the reality of the coming war. They should look to the Bible. It is full of such wars. Only the black flag will bring the North quickly to their senses and rapidly end the war."
I disagree completely with the sentiment expressed in this post.
ReplyDeleteWe need to do everything we can to get this passed into law. If this will be the straw to break the camel's back, then so be it. We are so far past the point of no return that we need the fight to happen as soon as possible if there is going to be anything left to fight for.
I always love the irony of our Civil War. One side fought for the Liberty to keep another man as slave. One side crapped on the Liberties of all to set that man free.
ReplyDeleteJim Klein is dead nuts to right.
ReplyDeleteNow listen you guys, this is the thing. The tyranny breathing down our throats is some serious shit in no doubt. But it is serious only in its size and scope. The motives behind it are as old as man himself. The thing is, and this is where it gets complicated for folks who have not grasped the logic of it yet, the thing is, what is it that motivates we of the people under the boot of tyranny?
This is the million dollar question. As Mr. Klein put it only you can figure that out. But he gives the best clue ever invented. As Patrick Henry said, it was Liberty or it was death. Just as Mr. Klein said, he is climbing that mount. And come hell or high water, nothing is going to stop him.
Do you see my fellow Americans? Do you feel in your heart what Mr. Klein believes?
Ceterum Autem Censeo,
ReplyDeleteObama delenda est.
My thoughts on this at pluckingtheyew.blogspot.com
ReplyDeleteJosh K.-
ReplyDeleteYou are perpetuating FedGov lis RE: War of Secession, and I must call you on it here.
Anon 10:55
Obama is not the problem. He is a symptom. NDAA would've happened without him.
He is a symptom, and like a cold sore, messing with Obama will only spread the disease.
He is also the key to the restoration of liberty in this nation.
Think.
My words are not false.
AP
Josh- *lies*, not "lis".
ReplyDeleteThat is a lie that has been used as a weapon against the 10th Amendment ever since.
AP
So, Fill me in...why did the South seceded if not to protect their way of life?
ReplyDeleteI never said the Fed was right to break the 10th...
South had the right to secede....They didn't like the North telling them what to do. The Fed was incrouching on the states rights. Oneof them being the right to own slaves.
By your own logic Blacks in the South had the right to armed revolt.
Would the South have emancipated the slaves on their own? If not they condoned keeping another man a slave while whining about their own Lyberty.... ironic I think.
Hmmm.... In my mind there was no good actors in the Civil War just those trying to hold on to their power base.
We like to play the victim in the south....
So, if our side wins how many of the far left radical will end up put into camps/prisons or just plain expelled from the new country/stateless sociaty?
This why I feel our sides no better than the left sometimes we will justfy doing what ever we want in the name of freedom.
Please explain to me why I'm wrong to think this. I already hear some hinting at getting pay back for the wrongs committed by the Fed....
And the cycle will continue.... and we will falsely continue to think ourselves free men, when we our still slaves to our own natures.
Hmmm....
Sorry for my own little rant here,
Josh
Josh-
ReplyDeleteYour words:
"South had the right to secede....They didn't like the North telling them what to do. The Fed was incrouching on the states rights. One of them being the right to own slaves.
By your own logic Blacks in the South had the right to armed revolt.
Would the South have emancipated the slaves on their own? If not they condoned keeping another man a slave while whining about their own Lyberty.... ironic I think."
I encourage you to study the economic weapons used against the South by the North. There was at least a thirty to forty year lead-up to secession and the war.
The slaves had the natural right to revolt, yes. No doubt. I never said otherwise. The "Emancipation Proclamation" was meant to encourage precisely this.
You tell me then, if the war was about slavery, why did the "North" keep slavery legal in the territories they controlled? You tell me then, why did they not invade the South and free the slaves earlier? The "Union" was fine with slavery until it could be used as a weapon to ensure compliance, as it has ever since.
Would the South have freed the slaves of their own volition?
Undoubtedly. It was an increasingly unsustainable institution. It was much cheaper to get a poor white family to sharecrop or work for dirt than it was to fully support blacks.
Read history with a balanced view. Many slaves were better off (at least physically) as slaves than after being freed. The system subjected them to a far more oppressive de facto slavery after the war.
Your average Southern soldier had as little to do with slavery as the American soldier in Afghanistan has to do with Obamacare mandates.
Be careful though...
Your words again:
"If not they condoned keeping another man a slave while whining about their own Lyberty.... ironic I think.
What "right" had the colonists to secede from England and "whine", as you put it, about liberty?
Is the Declaration of Independence then null and void in your estimation?
Was the revolution about slavery?
Hmm.
AP
"You tell me then, if the war was about slavery, why did the "North" keep slavery legal in the territories they controlled? You tell me then, why did they not invade the South and free the slaves earlier? The "Union" was fine with slavery until it could be used as a weapon to ensure compliance, as it has ever since" - AP
ReplyDeleteSlavery was the compromise 3/5 of a person. The Civil war was inevidabale. The founding Fathers that where against slavery didn't have he stomach for another war and fear thst if a civil war broke out as they where a new nation the British would come snd scoop them back up.
Not being able to out law slavery completely doesn't equate to condoning it.
The only reason we have the 10th amendment was so that those in the South would ratify the Constitution.
The only reason we have a 'Fed' is the Founding Fathers Last the will to fight.
Compromises are never a good thing in a government, doing nothing would of been better than our curent system.
The reason we have the amedment process is so we can go back and fix the things that where compromised on.
"Read history with a balanced view. Many slaves were better off (at least physically) as slaves than after being freed. The system subjected them to a far more oppressive de facto slavery after the war." - AP
I have pets some can say they are healthier and live long than if they where in the wild, does make them free though. To be self-reliant is a skill like any other. We have about 52% of our population slaved to the Fed in someway how is just kicking them lose going to be any different than what happened to the blacks after the war?
I'm working on a plain to form institution to promote self-reliance & personal responsibility. This I think has a better chance of forming last freedom than continueing this cycle of revolution?
But I could be wrong we are human and tend to f*** Sh** Up.
P.S. The reason the One was in bold was Slavery was a readon, maybe not even the most import reason for the Fed as alowwing secession weekens the Feds power.
ReplyDeleteBut it still doesn't negate that I still find it ironc the Liberty/Slavery conundrum of the South Pre-Civil War.
No the Declaration of Independance stands as is ...All Men Created Equal....
ReplyDelete....Life, Liberty and Property...... no lets change that to the Pursuit of Happiness we would want any confusion as to what we mean by property...,,
There you go again.
ReplyDeleteYour words, emphasis changed a bit:
"No the Declaration of Independance stands as is ...All Men Created Equal...."
Are you then a sexist, as were the founders?
;-)
You know as well as I do that the founders were not talking about slaves when they wrote that.
As ratified, who could vote under the Constitution?
White.
Landowning.
Men.
Men are fallible, and our founders "cried" for liberty while holding slaves themselves.
Just as you charge the South with.
One cannot condemn the South without condemning the colonies.
Different times, I guess.
Also, we would do well to bear in mind that there is more than one type of slave. There is more than one mode of oppression.
Even in a perfectly "Jeffersonian" free libertarian fantasy utopia, someone will feel oppressed.
Likely it would be the person in the corner who could "just use a little temporary help".
Thus, one man steals from (and enslaves) another, and tyranny is reborn.
The War of Secession was not about slavery, any more than the "War on Terror" is about "them" supposedly "hating us because we're free".
It would have happened even if the South had freed its slaves decades ago.
Now everyone's a slave on Uncle Sam's Plantation.
Ain't it grand.
AP
Josh-
ReplyDelete"This I think has a better chance of forming last freedom than continueing this cycle of revolution?"
I sincerely hope the cycle never ends.
It is purification, and it happens in every part of nature, from plants to wolf packs and prides of lions.
Humans are arrogant to think themselves exempt.
AP
PS- I am enjoying this dialogue greatly.
AP -
ReplyDeleteAre you suggesting that their is no such thing as self-disipline or personal responsibilty? Because with out these qualities a stateless societiy is not possible. It is forgetting that we are lazy & selfish creatures that will allow future generations to grow apathtic in their defense of Liberty.
AP, Who do I have to thank for instill this great love of Liberty,personal responsibility and self-discipline? A father, mother, uncle, mentor or was through reading books?
These are all things we can and should foster in the general public.
3/5 was a direct result slavery; as those in the North new that if the south wad allowed to count slaves as people but be kept as property. the South would have a disproportionate larger representation in the new congresss; thus making it harder to legislate slavery out of existsnce.
The South got in bed with the North for a little temporary security figuring the could secede later if necessary.
That didn't work out so good for them.
The Civil War was a postponed fight that at the drafting neither side had the stomach for.
The Founding Fathers Should of paid heed to what Ben Franklen had to say about Liberty and Security.
PS. Me too!
PPS. I would love for a Stateless society to be possible, but first we have to master our own stupidity.
ReplyDeleteIf everyone would learn to mind theirown damn business, stop worrying about what everyone else is doing there would be no need forgovernments of any kind.
Sigh... thats my dream.
All the f'n busybodies out trying to tell a man how to live need to get theirown life in order before even contemplating giving someone else advice.
;-) Me included.
Also, voting at that time was based on land owner ship. Woman had the right to vote if property was in their name. That did change to right before ir after the Civil War, I forget.
ReplyDeleteSorry my brain is a jumbled mess running at a thousound miles an hour. LoL
To all the unreconstructed Southrons still nursing grudges against Anglo-Saxon supremacy:
ReplyDeleteDid you know ... the Saxons were first invited to Britain as mercenaries hired by Britonic tribes who could not manage to defeat Pict raiders?
The Saxons were to be paid in land but, not unlike today's sleazy politicians, the Britons reneged on the deal and by AD450 or so, the Saxons had their fill of Britonic double-talk and simply took Britain itself as collateral in lieu of payment.
Problem solved.
And you guys have been bitching and starting wars over it ever since.
Maybe it's time to rethink your stragegy.
Or the grudge itself.
Anglo-Saxon Yankees are not your enemies and have nothing to do with our present mess anymore than lazy, wannabe royalty slaveholders had with the Civil War -- wounded egos not withstanding.
Too many of us get hung up on trivia and confuse INTEREST with POSITION.
DON'T.